posted
My son has a 2002 Camaro Z28. He had a local mechanic (a friend) who is VERY good with differentials and everything else, change the fluid in his diff and check it out. It turns out he says the carrier is messed up from a slipped bearing??? It had ALOT of metal shavings in it and according to him the diff needs to be completely replaced.
Well the dealer is saying that because he has SFC's and better LCA's that the warranty on the differential is voided, which is absolutely absurd.
I need to know who or how to find out who the GM service rep is for the area around Louisville, KY.
Any help is appreciated.
Thanks!!!
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Kevin Villier, 2002 SS #186 - 6M with Hurst and "short-stick", TT, navy blue, chrome SS wheels, Bilstein suspension, SS grill, BMR STB, BMR chrome-moly panhard rod, SLP loudmouth, Direct-Flo lid with Holley Power Shot filter, mallory polished MAF ends, 4.10 gears, PPC LT's. 336 rwhp, 345 rwtq
posted
I would suggest calling GM customer assiatance or trying another dealer. Or I would tell your dealer that you want to speak with the AVM for your area. Try that first. If not let me know.
Posts: 1045 | From: Seattle, WA | Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
Or, put the orignal RLCA's on and if they are bolt on SFC's take them off and go to another dealer.
Posts: 5946 | From: Litchfield, NH, USA | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote:Originally posted by DanA_F99_1977: Or, put the orignal RLCA's on and if they are bolt on SFC's take them off and go to another dealer.
Understand your point but I think HTWLSS is right on this one. There is no justification not to cover because of LCAs and SFCs - what's next - no coverage on wheels because you changed tires? No coverage on the battery because you upgraded alternator belt? Escalate to the Zone manager.
Posts: 3403 | From: Woodcliff Lake, NJ, USA | Registered: Dec 2000
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posted
The SEMA website is your best bet. The "law" states that if the modifications do not affect the warranteed area, then the warranty is still valid. Putting STB's on can't void the radio warranty - that type of thing.
Posts: 1163 | From: Rochester Hills, Mi | Registered: Feb 2000
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quote: what's next - no coverage on wheels because you changed tires?
Funny you should mention that!! A while ago when I had a major issue with a third party extended warranty company over an attempt to unilaterally deny warranty work coverage due to aftermarket parts on the car, I took a look at the policy fine print. Sure enough if you changed the tires (i.e.: to different size) no coverage.
That meant that if you put snow tires on the car they could deny coverage on warranty repairs, since most snow tires for our cars are narrower but with higher sidewalls, thereby, giving the same rolling diameter....but still a different size.
It was an eye opener for me.
Bill M 98 TA
Posts: 383 | From: Oakville, Ontario Canada | Registered: Jan 2003
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quote:Originally posted by Kevin V 2002 SS: No offense Scott, but it seems that GM service just keeps getting worse, I don't understand it. It isn't like they loose money by doing warranty work.
:cynic mode: This is why GM is talking so much about building "gotta have" vehicles. They certainly don't draw customers with their service. I'm dealing with an issue on our Envoy now that has been "repaired" unsuccessfully 6 times since May of last year. I've finally filed for arbitration to see if that will lite a fire under them :end cynic mode:
Posts: 4222 | From: Winnipeg MB CA | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
He got the call, the denied the warranty work, because of better LCA's and a panhard rod. So now GM delaers and reps deny warranty work illegally.
Can someone explain tpo me how in the $&$&*($* that anyone that knows anything about cars, could think that better LCA's and panhard rod would cause the damage to the differential. It is impossible. But that is what they did.
Unless I break down and buy a corvette, in spite of lousy GM service, I'll never buy another GM vehicle.
Now he is going to pick up his car and then call the GM rep himself and see what this idiot, who apparently doesn't know squat about cars, can explain exactly how these "better" parts, that won't impact the differential at all, caused the problem.
This is really pathetic. Sorry for ranting.
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
GO ahead and rant. I know exactly how frustrating this can be. As crazy as this may sound...are you sure that the dealer actually contacted or got an answer from the GM rep?
One thing you can do is get the phone number for the regional GM office and ask to speak to the GM dealer service rep who looks after the dealership where your car is at.
If successful, you can ask him/her yourself and see if reason will prevail. Years ago, I did this successfully with an issue on a 1978 Camaro Z28.
In that case, the driveshaft needed to be straightend and balanced. The dealer said it was not covered by warranty since the existing driveshaft was repaired. When asked, the dealer admitted that if it had been replaced it would have been covered by warranty, then, in the same breath, insisted I pay the bill. I didn't left the car there and called the regional office and reason prevailed.
It amazing that in 25 years nothing has changed.
We won't even talk about what a GM dealer recently did to me (with NO involvement or fault from GM) on my rear axle. Let's just say there were 4 fixes at a total cost of $7,500 with an out of court settlement of $4,500 (court settlement would have been higher but taken much longer).
Bill M 98 TA
Posts: 383 | From: Oakville, Ontario Canada | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
You aren't going to believe this. I went with my son to pick it up. The service manager was an absolute AHole. They NEVER looked at the engine noise or the differential. How can they deny something when they don't even know what is wrong. They essentially said that the entire car warranty is void because the car was "heaviliy" modified???? When he asked him "what modifications", the AH couldn't even tell him, the AH basically told him to "F OFF", how is that for great service. They saw the SFC, better LCA's and panhard rod and say that the warranty for the entire car is void, these people are insane. IF they even called the GM service rep, if they told him the car was heavily modified and didn't even bother to tell him it was a couple of better suspension pieces, no wonder they would say no. This has really got me pissed off. It would be one thing to dissapprove specific warranty work for a logical reason, but for NO reason. He couldn't even remotely tell my son WHY it wasn't covered under warranty. How can a service manager conclude something isn't covered when he doesn't know what is wrong and can't even explain why it wouldn't be covered. When my son asked him to put in writing why it it was denied, the AH told him "take it or leave it".
No wonder GM service has such a pathetic reputation. To bad all GM folks don't have the F-Bod Fathers great attitude.
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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quote:Originally posted by Kevin V 2002 SS: No wonder GM service has such a pathetic reputation. To bad all GM folks don't have the F-Bod Fathers great attitude.
You can say that again! If everyone in GM were like Scott, I wouldn't be surprised that GM would have a 90%+ market share.
But anyways. This definitely needs to be taken to higher authorities in the GM chain. It sucks beyond a doubt that one must literally fight for warranty service on their cars. I think if some GM rep came and physically looked at the car (and one that KNOWS friggin cars - come on, you work for GM!) you should get the car fixed. It's just a pain what we put up with for such nice cars. Wish the service would match the performance level.
Next wednesday I'll be taking my car in or minor warranty work. I'll have to let ya know how that pans out (holding breath)
Good Luck Kevin and your son. Keep us updated. I dont mind reading the rants
posted
They can't deny warranty for the whole car. Raed this and make a copy for them-then tell them you'll see them in court after you go to the local TV station and newspapers about how they took advantage of a kid ( http://www.enjoythedrive.com/content/?id=8128):
This federal law regulates warranties for the protection of consumers. The essence of the law concerning aftermarket auto parts is that a vehicle manufacturer may not condition a written or implied warranty on the consumers using parts or services which are identified by brand, trade, or corporate name (such as the vehicle maker's brand) unless the parts or service are provided free of charge. The law means that the use of an aftermarket part alone is not cause for denying the warranty. However, the law's protection does not extend to aftermarket parts in situations where such parts actually caused the damage being claimed under the warranty. Further, consumers are advised to be aware of any specific terms or conditions stated in the warranty which may result in its being voided. The law states in relevant part:
“No warrantor of a consumer product may condition his written or implied warranty of such product on the consumers using, in connection with such product, any article or service (other than article or service provided without charge under the terms of the warranty) which is identified by brand, trade or corporate name...” (15 U.S.C. 2302(C)).
[ 16. July 2003, 06:44 PM: Message edited by: JeffY ]
Posts: 1163 | From: Rochester Hills, Mi | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
I think the serevice manager knew they were breaking that law and didn't care. I believe that was why the guy wouldn't put anything in writing or answer my son's questions.
Thanks Jeff and everyone that responded.
[ 16. July 2003, 06:57 PM: Message edited by: Kevin V 2002 SS ]
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Ask to see the General Manager or Owner next - going to the top helps.
Posts: 1163 | From: Rochester Hills, Mi | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
Sorry you had such an unfortunate experience with your car. Unfortunately GM takes the blame for some lousy dealerships and the one you were at sounds like this. I have worked with several service dept managers that were of low caliber. It doesn't even sound like he contacted his AVM (GM rep). I am hesitant to give out other reps #'s I think you need to try a different dealer or go to the top at the place your at (General Manager or Owner). Just currious did you purchase the car from the dealer your trying to get work done at?
Also as I posted before contacting GM customer assiatance is important. First it documents the problems your having. They will contact the dealer and see whats going on.... also they may get in contact with the rep that covers that store. Just one other way to get the ball rolling....
[ 16. July 2003, 08:30 PM: Message edited by: MM ]
Posts: 1045 | From: Seattle, WA | Registered: Nov 2001
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quote:You can say that again! If everyone in GM were like Scott, I wouldn't be surprised that GM would have a 90%+ market share.
You have to remember its a company... to some its just a job, others are a little more pasionate about their work. Unfortunatily not everyone at GM is a gear head... Posts: 1045 | From: Seattle, WA | Registered: Nov 2001
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quote: Ask to see the General Manager or Owner next - going to the top helps.
That is a really good idea. One thing I might add is to put your experience in writing to him and request a face to face meeting.
This does several things. It shows you are serious and pissed off enough to take the time to write a letter, and it begins to build a paper trail if this goes the legal route. It is not to early to begin building a paper trail. I have personally done this, and got a sizeable selttlement from a GM dealer.
I think the suggestion to call GM customer service would not hurt, but I have never gotten any assistance from that route. It may get you the name and number for the GM rep who looks after the dealer though.
Good luck.
Bill M 98 TA
Posts: 383 | From: Oakville, Ontario Canada | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
My son talked to a GM rep and she couldn't understand what the problem was with doing it under warranty, with the suspension mods he had and that in no way would the warranty be voided on the entire car. She suggested putting back on the stock pieces and going back to a different dealer, that way the issue never even comes up.
This makes me believe the dealer never even called a GM rep in the first place, they just didn't want to mess with it and BS him about why. I've suggested to my son that he write letters to the dealer general manager and to GM customer service.
Thanks for the help everybody!!!!
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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Fbodfather
They don't make songs about Volvos.
Member # 1119
posted
Kevin....you have mail.
(see what happens when I take a week off???? Posts: 749 | From: Detroit | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
My son put the stock suspension parts back on and even took off the STB and SFC's. He took it to a different dealer and they wouldn't work on it because he had a cut-out on it. Saying that it completely voids the warranty on the car.
The dealer told him they can refuse ANY warranty work for whatever reason they want. That is some "customer service". So why would anyone want to buy a GM product anymore.
This is getting rediculous. So if we get minor damge to the car and have to get a fender replaced and painted does that also void the warranty on the entire car, MAYBE the accident caused the problem with something. He was even willing to pay them for their time to open it up just to check it out to confirm the problem and they refused to even look at it. Seems there is NO customer service anymore. From some local folks I talked to, local dealers do NOT want to do ANY kind of warranty work if they can find ANY, even if unfounded, excuse not to. Supposedly warranty work doesn't pay as much as what they charge a customer whop has to pay for the work, so they try to do as little warranty work as possible.
Guess I'd better not put in better speakers, it would void the entire warranty on my car.
He is going to call a GM rep, customer service or whoever and talk to them. I told him to get a "case number" and start fighting it. Scott, I'll keep you posted.
[ 21. July 2003, 02:46 PM: Message edited by: Kevin V 2002 SS ]
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
That's Crazy. To me, I think customer retention would be important. Do your service work, make warranty repairs, keep you happy so you keep on coming back and providing the dealership with income! Are they small dealerships?
I talked last week to my dealer abotu getting an oil change and some minor warranty work and didn't put up any kind of fuss and said they'll get it done. Hopefully that will hold true and dont give me excuses. (holding breath). Wish it would go better for you Kevin. I totally agree about not buying another GM car. I'm thinking the same thing down the road. Posts: 2651 | From: Enola (Harrisburg Area), Pennsylvania | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
If my son had caused damage to his car, he'd pay for it. The mechanic that noticed it even said it was a bad install from the factory that caused it.
This dealer flat stated they weren't going to even call a GM rep to check on whether it was covered by warranty, they just don't want to work on it. You'd think that to even be approved as a GM dealer/service that it would be a requirement to actually do applicable warranty work.
Here is something I don't understand either, in this "instant information age" when someone does something like this and it gets posted on a message board(s), instantly thousands of people are aware of the poor or complet lack of service provided. Talk about bad advertizing. But I guess they don't care about that either.
[ 21. July 2003, 03:06 PM: Message edited by: Kevin V 2002 SS ]
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
Well, when my son went to pick up his car he talked to them. They said the warranty wasn't void, they just don't want to work on it. Isn't doing warranty work a requirement to be a GM dealer. So if they can make more money on doing non-warranty work they can refuse to do all warranty work and GM allows this????
With some of the stories I've heard from local folks about our local GM dealers, I'm surprised anyone in the Louisville area would buy a GM product again.
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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posted
They are not supposed to turn down warranty work because they don't feel like it.... not sure why they wouldn't touch it? Sounds like the dealers down there need a little straightening out.... like a smack up side the head! As I said before some dealers don't want to work on cars that weren't purchased from them. Don't know why but you have a lot of places out there that don't realize that service is an important part of the buying experience. With poor service its hard to get a customer back.... Its sad that your having such a hard time trying to get something done down there. Only thing I can think of is they see a young guy with a Z and mods and assume he has been racing it etc. So they just don't want to deal with him. If your in the NW I could help you... no issues up here.
[ 22. July 2003, 09:07 AM: Message edited by: MM ]
Posts: 1045 | From: Seattle, WA | Registered: Nov 2001
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posted
It blows me away that a dealer does not want to do warranty aka service work. Especially the way dealers make their profit.
Typically new car sales run at break even or a loss and dealers make all their money in the service end. By saying we do not want to service you car is tantamont to saying we do not want to stay in business!!
Kevin, it sounds like you should have nothing to do with these guys. Even if you force them to do the warranty work it will most likely be done badly....given their attitude. I would run from them, but that's me.
Bill M 98 TA
Posts: 383 | From: Oakville, Ontario Canada | Registered: Jan 2003
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posted
I agree with not taking it to one of these dealers as they would likely do a lousy job.
On a possible good note, my son called around to a few other GM dealers and found one that actually said none of his after-market parts affect the warranty and would work on his car. Hopefully it will go well.
After he gets it fixed he will probably send letters of complaint to the other dealers, the BBB and GM.
I again would like to thank everybody for their help and comments. It just goes to show just how great F-Body drivers (especially SS's ) are.
[ 22. July 2003, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: Kevin V 2002 SS ]
Posts: 763 | From: Louisville, KY | Registered: Jun 2001
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