looking for a repair manual i could look at and read online about my 95 grandam with a quad four. i put a new starter on and all the wires going to it show power and the starter tested fine but the car won't turn over............
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on 10 December, 2003 06:54 AM:
Jump the starter solenoid on the starter from the 12v battery cable to the small terminal that gets 12v in the crank position.Make sure the starter is grounded good.If it does not turn over,while the small terminal has 12v to it,smack the starter with a hammer and see if it then works.If so you need to get a new starter or repair that one. Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 10 December, 2003 08:06 AM:
the starter tested good at a store i had it checked. thanks
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on 10 December, 2003 11:55 AM:
quote:Originally posted by jeffsz28: the starter tested good at a store i had it checked. thanks
Then if the 12v is present on the battery cable terminal and 12v present at the small terminal in the crank position,then the engine ground must not be any good.Do a voltage drop from the negative battery post to the block where the starter is mounted.Put the digital voltmeter on the 20v scale and hook it up at the negative cable post and the other lead on the engine block and read the voltage.A good ground will have no more than .5 volts. If you have more than .5 volts indiacating on the meter,there is a high resistance in the ground side,possibly a dirty cable terminal or bad cable.While you are there voltage drop the positive cable from the battery to the starter too.Same .5 volts or less applies for all circuits in the car.Good luck.
Posted by Z28-SORR (Member # 1565) on 10 December, 2003 11:58 AM:
Jeff, Need more info. Does the starter make any noise when you try to start the engine. Clicking or humming, does it get hot? Do you have an inductive(load) attachment for your multimeter. Hooks around the starter cable and shows how much amperage is beening drawn for the starter. If high amps. then something is stuck.
Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 10 December, 2003 12:22 PM:
i turnd the motor over by hand with grabing the belts, motor isn't froze up. tested all the fuses also and they are good. another guy said he had the same problem and the starter and caused a surge that fired his neutral safety switch... strange? anyhow - i looked under my car- 95 grandam with a quad 4 and a three speed auto. underneath i see nothing put just the normal plug in to the tranny. if it was this switch where would i find it?? thanks - also the starter does nothing-no noise or anything,never got hot either.
Posted by CamaroSCG (Member # 1591) on 10 December, 2003 01:33 PM:
I had a bad positive cable (the large one from the battery to the starter)many. years ago on a '65 Chevy Impala. I finally found it by using a jumper cable from the positive battery post to the starter. The cable looked fine from the outside, but once I started to flex it, I found the bad spot.
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on 11 December, 2003 06:43 AM:
quote:Originally posted by jeffsz28: i turnd the motor over by hand with grabing the belts, motor isn't froze up. tested all the fuses also and they are good. another guy said he had the same problem and the starter and caused a surge that fired his neutral safety switch... strange? anyhow - i looked under my car- 95 grandam with a quad 4 and a three speed auto. underneath i see nothing put just the normal plug in to the tranny. if it was this switch where would i find it?? thanks - also the starter does nothing-no noise or anything,never got hot either.
If the neutral safety switch was bad then you would not have 12v in the crank position at the small terminal of the starter.
Posted by Z28-SORR (Member # 1565) on 11 December, 2003 11:09 AM:
This is getting strainger by the day. If the starter is good and you have twelve volts at the starter and soleniod, then the only thing left is a bad ground. Here's an old trick. With the starter installed CAREFULLY take a screw driver and short directly between the bat cable and the start terminal at the solenoid. This will bypass all ignition and other switches. If the starter doesn't turn over either it or the solenoid are bad or there is a bad ground.
Good Luck
P.S. You can also purchase a switch for this at the auto parts store. It hooks between these two terminals for remote starting. It's only a couple of dollars.
[ 11. December 2003, 11:12 AM: Message edited by: Z28-SORR ]
Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 11 December, 2003 09:33 PM:
guys how bout this........ guy i talekd to said that he thinks my timming went out- chain broke- he said he use to raise cars and had it happen before and the cars would act just like mine then one day just quit..... i will look at it tomorrow wish me luck.................
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on 12 December, 2003 06:49 AM:
quote:Originally posted by jeffsz28: guys how bout this........ guy i talekd to said that he thinks my timming went out- chain broke- he said he use to raise cars and had it happen before and the cars would act just like mine then one day just quit..... i will look at it tomorrow wish me luck.................
I thought you concern was the engine would not crank over? A timing chain is far from a no crank concern. Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 12 December, 2003 07:10 AM:
if the timming chain brakes then the engine won't crank over, but wha tyour saying is that the starter would still make noise...
Posted by Steve da Wrench (Member # 1301) on 12 December, 2003 10:12 AM:
wrong, guys. If the timing chain breaks, it has NOTHING to do with cranking over. It will still crank just fine (maybe a bit uneven, but will crank, nonetheless).
What you are telling us makes no sense though. If you have 12 volts (WHILE CRANKING) to the positive terminal, and 12 volts to the trigger wire lead, and a good ground, and the starter is fine, then it HAS to crank. Something tells me you are missing something, and not testing it actually under load (meaning test the voltage to the starter WHILE trying to crank). Good luck.
Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 13 December, 2003 12:29 PM:
i'm throwing in the towels guys- starter turns over fine- all wires are tight/clean- grounds are tight and clean-battery and cables are good. fuel pump comes on each time. so i have no clue why it just won't kick over all the way.....
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on 15 December, 2003 06:54 AM:
quote:Originally posted by jeffsz28: i'm throwing in the towels guys- starter turns over fine- all wires are tight/clean- grounds are tight and clean-battery and cables are good. fuel pump comes on each time. so i have no clue why it just won't kick over all the way.....
Is the starter shimmed properly and is the correct one for the flywheel you have?
Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 15 December, 2003 10:39 PM:
i dropped it off at the shop and they can work on it.
Posted by CamaroSCG (Member # 1591) on 18 December, 2003 08:13 AM:
Let us know what the fix was. Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 19 December, 2003 08:04 AM:
get this - whole car was checked over and found nothing until the spark plugs were pulled.. they had nothing let not even enough to spark. but here is the killer- the car ran perfect,idle was great then just one day it wouldn't start at all. strange any car i have worked on you can tell plugs or going bad... thanks guys
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on 19 December, 2003 09:18 AM:
quote:Originally posted by jeffsz28: get this - whole car was checked over and found nothing until the spark plugs were pulled.. they had nothing let not even enough to spark. but here is the killer- the car ran perfect,idle was great then just one day it wouldn't start at all. strange any car i have worked on you can tell plugs or going bad... thanks guys
Ok,now I am really confused! You 1st stated that the engine would not crank.That would normally be a bad starter,battery or starter wiring,ignition switch,fuse link. Now It sounds like a no spark concern.That is not a no crank,but a crank no start.
Posted by Steve da Wrench (Member # 1301) on 19 December, 2003 10:35 AM:
I second 2002z4c opinion! You kept repeatedly telling us it would not CRANK over at all, and that it did nothing! Now you are saying it would not start but it was cranking the entire time??? WTF???
If you had actually told us what it was doing, you would not have had to waste all of that timing changing out parts and driving around to the store and such.
Just a heads up for anybody else trying to get help with their cars........... and I run into this everyday.........
Make sure you tell whoever it is that you are giving the info on your car, what the symptoms are, and not what you think the problem is, as it will save you all time and grief and most likely money in the long run.
Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 20 December, 2003 08:06 AM:
yes the new starter wouldn't crank at all until it was installed in the car bolted to the block. that day i did that and the motor wouldn't really do anything,just barely crank for a second. the plugs had no spark at all. yet the idle on the car was always good even acouple weeks ago when the car acted strange with starting up...
Posted by jeffsz28 (Member # 2128) on 20 December, 2003 08:08 AM:
also the car turns over so quick now its crazy. i barely turn the key and the car fires over. that in saying the starter could have been going bad to.
Posted by DaddySS (Member # 848) on 27 December, 2003 06:40 AM:
quote:Originally posted by jeffsz28: also the car turns over so quick now its crazy. i barely turn the key and the car fires over. that in saying the starter could have been going bad to.
Glad it worked out in the end.
For future reference and so Steve doesn't lose his mind: Turn over (as in rotate) indicates the engine spinning, turning, cranking, etc.
Start (as in combustion and rotation) is ususally referred to as "fire up, ignite, run, start, light the candles, power up, etc.
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
