Yup, never thought I woudl see the day (ok...maybe I could) GM better be on its toes adn do something!! I only hope they are heading in the right direction....
Things look very good for Toyota. As stated in the article:
quote: Indeed, at over $120 billion, Toyota's market capitalization -- a measure of how much investors believe a company is worth -- is more than four times that of Ford, and bigger than the combined stock values of Ford, GM and DaimlerChrysler
By profitability, too, Toyota is way ahead of the pack.
Things do not look good for GM as well as Ford in terms of maintaining their dominance.
Posted by Mark IXZD 150 (Member # 235) on :
Maybe it's about time for another bomb. Posted by TimeLord (Member # 1389) on :
Profits are high when you aren't dependant on rebates as the only arguement in favor of your inferior[real or perceived]product!!!!
Toyota delivers quality,reliability,great customer service andd respect for the client,,,= VALUE !!!!!
[ 26. January 2004, 06:12 PM: Message edited by: TimeLord ]
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on :
I hate to hear this mainly because most of the people that live in Southeast Michigan work for GM,Ford, or Diamler-Chrysler. I would hate to see the economy in this state go to heck from the loss of jobs.This is the one and only reason I will never buy a non-domestic vehicle plus I too work for Ford and kinda like my job.
Posted by jimb0 (Member # 176) on :
....more and more of my truck owning friends that used to be die-hard "Buy American" advocates have recently switched over to Toyota and Nissan trucks...now that they both offer full size trucks if you look at the price of a full-sized Big 3 truck compared to the price of the imports, there is quite a large price delta. A lot of the Big 3 trucks being sold today are being done so on their past reputations or the fact the most public service agencies purchase them now, giving the impression that these trucks are superior. If state and local agencies start buying Toyotas on a fleet level the playing field could change in a hurry. Look at what happened to International Navistar…they used to be the undisputed leader for suppliers of school bus chassis, state and local fleet vehicles, emergency vehicles and commercial vehicles for the military. Freightliner came on the scene with a better and more competitively priced chassis, and in a very short period they are now one of the top suppliers for these vehicles. The fact that many imports are now built in the US has further eroded that mindset. It would not surprise me in the least for Toyota to present a very serious challenge to GM in the very near future…
Posted by SS_CarGuy (Member # 2065) on :
If profitabilty is high, and sales are climbing...and exceeding Ford at this point, and capitalization dramatically exceeds the competition, Toyota will soon dominate the auto industry. Their formula of producing excellent reliable vehicles which are sold at a very competitive price and have better (perceived) service by individual dealers is exacly what the rest of the auto industry needs to do too. Are they up to it?.....Only time will tell.
Posted by Harry P (Member # 533) on :
My $0.02. I don't dispute that Toyota won't take over the automotive world. That said, what I will never understand is the average American's nearsightedness when it comes to supporting the economy that supports us.
GM is America's largest employer with exception of the postal service and the US government. Figure in the massive commitment GM has to support its pension plans (aka retired Americans), and the numbers are staggering. GM & Ford builds AND assembles autos/trucks here (although, in order to compete, that will continue to decline with time). Despite three decades of what Consumer Reports says, American products are well made and are as reliable as any brand. The domestic auto industry employs about half of our population, either directly or indirectly. What happens when we stop building AND assembling cars & trucks here?
While many foreign makers assemble here, they do so for the tax advantages and favorable exchange rates. Many of their major components are built overseas. Their numbers don't compare to the domestics in terms of employment.
But the point that drives me crazy is the uneven playing field we have with the Japanese. They can sell all they want here, but we are barred from their markets. For those that believe the Japanese people will never buy American products at home, they don't understand the Japanese. They are great consumers and have always had a penchant for purchasing what is "cool" or cutting edge. So it is with Harley-Davidson in Japan over the past decade and a half, but H-D is limited by quotas so they can't sell all they would like to. As soon as we attempted doing something similar to steel imports here, the WTO et al came down on us and forced us to open our markets. I will never respect the Japanese government until they do the same. Socialism is a poor quality for an alleged capitalist trading partner.
Posted by TimeLord (Member # 1389) on :
It is the same shortsightedness that makes Wal-Mart,Costco etc. so strong,save $0.20 on a product but export the job to Asia,you ain't seen anything yet!!!!!!!
[ 27. January 2004, 11:08 AM: Message edited by: TimeLord ]
Posted by SVT THIS (Member # 1352) on :
Well, I pretty much saw it coming. After I took an Operations Management course at PSU, we did A LOT of comparisons of Toyota vs GM. Withought a doubt, the efficiency of Toyota is unbeleivable! The abilitly to walk into a Japanese dealer and order a car (they only have one or two cars on teh lots because spcae is limited due to the high cost of real estate) adn within minutes, you are given a print out of the production dates and times of your car and an exact time in the future (within a few weeks) to come to the dealer to pick up your new car! Just-in-time methods and similar methods (eg. manufacturing methods) defintiely has helped Toyota excel and continue to move towards the top. Wont take too long to get ahead of GM (and yet, they dont have near as many employees, basically becasue of their efficiency). We'll see..... Posted by KevinA (Member # 139) on :
Having owned both Japanese vehicles and American vehicles I can honestly say that that the Japs have held up and had better quality than the American counterparts.
I'm all for buying American but I'm also for buying in what you believe to be the best.
The American car indusrty has a long way to go to get the public to buy it's cars again.
My sister has a 2000 Ford Windstar that has had 12 recalls and more problems than you can shake a stick at. It spends more time in the show for warranty repairs than it should. Her hubby has a Pontiac Montana with no problems.
I'm certain that GM is on it's way to improving the car line up and the quality/perceived quality (per quotes from the F-bod father).
Ford and Chrysler have a long way to go in terms of qualtiy.
When I buy my next car I will certainly look at anything American but I will also look at the Foreign counterparts so I can make the best decision possible. it's called checking all available options.
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For those that believe the Japanese people will never buy American products at home, they don't understand the Japanese. They are great consumers and have always had a penchant for purchasing what is "cool" or cutting edge. So it is with Harley-Davidson in Japan over the past decade and a half, but H-D is limited by quotas so they can't sell all they would like to. As soon as we attempted doing something similar to steel imports here, the WTO et al came down on us and forced us to open our markets. ![[Frown]](frown.gif)