These so call people are ruthless. Posted by RagSS (Member # 1127) on :
I'm sorry, but those sick Ba$tards should burn in HeII !!!!! ...it just turns my stomach what those cowards are doing Posted by Rhode Island Red (Member # 220) on :
I say bring back public stonings Posted by TimeLord (Member # 1389) on :
They have public stonings allready in the Islam faith,,,,they are also doing this because God is on their side and they are right.
[In their minds anyway]
How can God be on everyones side????
War should be restricted to soldiers like in the WW1-WW2 conflicts,this guerilla shyt and hostage taking is a sacrilege!!!!! Posted by cytruffle (Member # 1733) on :
quote:Originally posted by TimeLord: War should be restricted to soldiers like in the WW1-WW2 conflicts,this guerilla shyt and hostage taking is a sacrilege!!!!!
What about Hiroshima and Nagasaki?? ...and who could possibly enforce a rule like that?? Not trying to be argumentative.....war just sux, no matter how you slice it...and it seems to be an inevitable part of human existence.... Posted by Harry P (Member # 533) on :
I know I'm not supposed to hold their behavior against all Muslims, but really, every time they pull this crap, they might as well take a dump on Allah's face... that's how it's going to affect world view, now that other citizens are dying at the hands of a bunch of Muslim masked cowards.
Posted by Sizzle (Member # 503) on :
Over the history of man, how many bad things have been done in the name of "God" or a god?
Not that we are innocent, as we probably would not care about that part of the world if it was not for the oil, and they wouldn't care about us if it was not for our wealth. However, you don't see the U.S. cutting of the heads of captured enemies. That is just cowardly.
Posted by jimb0 (Member # 176) on :
I am just going to make one statement here...
...in Iraq, we are dealing with a people and a culture and a mindset whose reasoning, motives and priorities we still (and obviously won't for many years to come) don't understand...
...and to everyone who says "what's the big deal about what we did to the prisoners we took...it's no worse than a college hazing" only goes to prove the point...over and over again...
...and before any of you jump in to flame me, I'm not saying what we did was wrong, what I'm saying is that what we did to them in their minds was worse than killing them...
...the radicals respond in the only way they know how. Does anyone here doubt that our actions in Iraq have perpetrated these kidnappings? Do you feel that our actions against Iraq were worth the price we have paid so far...and the price we have still yet to pay, both oveerseas and in our homeland?
...please really think about that before responding...
Posted by Hawkeye (Member # 88) on :
They are of a different mind set than we are in North America. The U.S. dropped the bombs on Japan to stop the Japanese from fighting.
Thousands and thousands of innocent Japanese were killed, however with the threat of #3 going downtown Tokyo, they surrendered. It took years off of WW2 and saved thousands of G.Is.
Could it be done today? I doubt it.
Just before World War 1, there were a number of terrorist attacks on the United States forces in the Philippines by Muslim extremists. So General Pershing captured 50 terrorists and had them tied to posts for execution. He then had his men bring in twp pigs and slaughter them in front of the now horrified terrorists. Muslims detest pork because they believe pigs are filthy animals. Some of them simply refuse to eat it, while others won't even touch pigs at all, nor any of their by-products. To them, eating or touching a pig, its meat, its blood etc. is to be instantly barred from paradise(and those virgins) and doomed to hell. The soldiers then soaked their bullets in the pigs blood, and proceeded to execute 49 of the terrorists by firing squad. The soldiers then dug a big hole, dumped in the terrorist's bodies and covered them in pig blood, entrails etc. They let the 50th man go. And for the next forty-two years, there was not a single Muslim extremist attack anywhere in the world. Maybe it is time for this segment of history to repeat itself, maybe in Iraq?
The question is, where do we find another Black Jack Pershing?
Posted by FireChicken (Member # 2067) on :
I think I have some applicable points here.
First, the atomic bombs were dropped on Japan for 2 reasons: One was the fact that the estimates for the loss of life in an assault for Japan's main island would have been about 100,000. For reference, the number for D-day was around 5 thousand. The second reason is that he japanese had been experimenting with bubonic plauge as a biological weapon, and actually did some tests on different delivery systems over China. There are still parts of china that suffer from cases of the black death, as a result of this. The decision to drop the boms was made to satisfy utilitarian ethics and save american lives, while at the same time preventing the Empire Of Japan from launching an epidemic of the black death on our western seaboard.
Second, there are many reasons for us to be in iraq. You have to remember that this is not the first time a western invasion of the middle east has occurred. the crusades were the first (at least since the fall of the roman empire). The crusades occurred because the moors (muslim fanatics) actually began traveling into southern Europe and trying to conquor it in "The name of God". So, the catholics went to war in "The name of God." Of course, while the crusades did not really succeed in the typical sense of freeing the holy land, it did send a strong signal that muslim's could not colonize and convert Europe without a fight. Of course, there were many sane heads in the middle east at that time, Salladin being one of them. He tried to come to a peace agreement with the Christians, but by that time the catholics' religions ferver was at its own peak, and so it just resulted in people dying. the middle east today is a very unusual place, and we have to go after threats. Everyone wants proof of threat, but no one, not even the CIA, is 100% right about everything. And think of it this way: Assume that Hussein did not have weapons. everyone in the middle east hated him, and would have attacked at a moment's notice. Do you really think WE would have defended iraq against another war with Iran, or perhaps with Saudi Arabia or the United Arab Emirates? Ha. The only thing that kept his enemies at bay was the threat of WMD's, sinc he had used them before, against kuwait, iran, israel, his own people... His enemies knew the cost of war with iraq, and so they sought peace, however unsteady. But Hussein used his weapons as a deterrent against aggressors (ironic, isnt it?). So if he admitted to the entire world that he had no weapons, how long do you think it would be before someone attacked him? How long before someone invaded Iraq? how long before syrians or iranians smuggled a weapon of their own into baghdad, karbala, or fallujah and killed a few thousand people? Now ask yourself this: if you were hussein, and you had no weapons, would you openly admit it? Hell no! You would act like you did, and fight inspectors and the UN every step of the way, smelling your own demise on the horizon. And that is exactly what hussein did. There is trace evidence, equipment, paper trails, but no actual weapons have been found yet. Now ask yourself this: If he didnt ahve them, but acted like he did, how are we supposed to tell the difference? And dare we risk being wrong, and not go to war, leaving the possibility open that we were wrong, and he did have them? Going into Iraq is completely and totally justified for a variety of reasons that i will leave to another post.
Third, you have to understand that these extremests are the "David Koreshes" of the muslim world. I have several friends who are muslim here at A&M, and they actually kicked out a palestinian boy from the on-campus muslim organization because he was, as my friends put it, "one of those crazy arabs". Basically, he was just a radical anti-america, anti-israel muslim, which really begs the question why is he going to school at a conservative Texas university in America??? At any rate, you find these people in every religion. Its important to understand WHY.
The why is simple. these people do NOT want the interim goverment to succeed. They want America out, and NOW, because if we go, the enforcement of the interim government by our troops will end, and the interim government will be weakened. This will result in a civil war, with all of these radical clerics and al-qaeda factiosn fighting it out for control. One of them will win, and control iraq. They all believe they have a chance, which is why so many groups are doing the same thing. If you think about it, you will remember that back in january, they wanted america gone in 3 months. Last september, they wanted america gone in 6 months. As the date for transition gets closer, they get more aggressive, more forceful, and now they are just going for shock value. They think that these tactics will force nations to pull out.
Unfortunately, the story of Black Jack Pershing is quite inspiring, but its also not going to work. we get angry about executions of civilians, but they will react to anything we do with more of the same. Need a case in point? The Israeli-Palestinian conflict. Although the Israelis act in kind for attacks against their people, they form a cycle of violence.
What we need, is something that will break down the religious ferver. In the middle ages, the catholic church was very powerful. then an invention called the printing press came along. The church originally denounced it as an instrument of the devil, based on the concern that printing press could be used to disseminate secular (non-church) material, and thus weaken the power of the church. But then someone pointed out that they could print bibles, and so the church rescinded their earlier opinion. Of course, the renaissance brought about a vast secularization of European society, and the 1 chursh splintered into many factions, some more religious than others. But weakening the power of the church weakend its political hold on nations, and its hold on people.
If we do the same, we can break the backbone of the fanatacism and ferver of the religions in Iraq. Sunni, Shiate, and Kurds will all lose some of the craziness in their faith if they being to find out that there is more to life than just devotion to God (regardless of your personal opinion). So, what does this mean? Time to bring on the music, television, movie theaters, and all forms of entertainment! Let hollywood take charge of tearing down morals and values, they have gotten good at it over the years.
Other than that, I believe there is a Marine Corps T-shirt that describes my personal philosophy.
"Kill em all, let God sort em out."
[ 23. June 2004, 09:19 AM: Message edited by: FireChicken ]
Posted by Jim Mac (Member # 113) on :
quote:Originally posted by Hawkeye: They are of a different mind set than we are in North America. The U.S. dropped the bombs on Japan to stop the Japanese from fighting.
Thousands and thousands of innocent Japanese were killed, however with the threat of #3 going downtown Tokyo, they surrendered. It took years off of WW2 and saved thousands of G.Is.
Could it be done today? I doubt it.
What's fascinating about this is that we got Japan to surrender on a bluff. The US was months away from getting enough processed uranium to build more atomic bombs, but the Japanese didn't know this!
quote:Originally posted by Hawkeye: Just before World War 1, there were a number of terrorist attacks on the United States forces in the Philippines by Muslim extremists. So General Pershing captured 50 terrorists and had them tied to posts for execution. He then had his men bring in twp pigs and slaughter them in front of the now horrified terrorists. Muslims detest pork because they believe pigs are filthy animals. Some of them simply refuse to eat it, while others won't even touch pigs at all, nor any of their by-products. To them, eating or touching a pig, its meat, its blood etc. is to be instantly barred from paradise(and those virgins) and doomed to hell. The soldiers then soaked their bullets in the pigs blood, and proceeded to execute 49 of the terrorists by firing squad. The soldiers then dug a big hole, dumped in the terrorist's bodies and covered them in pig blood, entrails etc. They let the 50th man go. And for the next forty-two years, there was not a single Muslim extremist attack anywhere in the world. Maybe it is time for this segment of history to repeat itself, maybe in Iraq?
The question is, where do we find another Black Jack Pershing?
The question really is whether this is true. I've never been able to dig up anything that factually supports this, and the Urban Legends Reference Page confirms this.
quote:Originally posted by FireChicken: I think I have some applicable points here.
First, the atomic bombs were dropped on Japan for 2 reasons: One was the fact that the estimates for the loss of life in an assault for Japan's main island would have been about 100,000. For reference, the number for D-day was around 5 thousand. The second reason is that he japanese had been experimenting with bubonic plauge as a biological weapon, and actually did some tests on different delivery systems over China. There are still parts of china that suffer from cases of the black death, as a result of this. The decision to drop the boms was made to satisfy utilitarian ethics and save american lives, while at the same time preventing the Empire Of Japan from launching an epidemic of the black death on our western seaboard.
Man, you write way too much - did you go to the Clancy School of Writing?
Anyway, just wanted to correct a few things in what you said above. Truman wrestled long and hard on whether to drop the atomic bombs or not. The main reason he chose to do so were the estimated casualties to take Japan (estimates were around ONE MILLION, not a hundred thousand) and the waning support for the war at home. His biggest concern was that the loss of life from invading Japan would so sicken the public, that the job would never be completed, leaving Japan the ability to rearm itself. Interestingly enough, once we occupied Japan and saw their defenses, estimates for casualties were raised to between TWO and THREE MILLION.
Posted by Hawkeye (Member # 88) on :
It's entirely possible - legend only about General Black Jack, however - I copied it from a story in a newspaper, and in that era I expect that things like that were more possible than today!
The earlier reference to Israel was interesting.
There is an outstanding quote by Gold Meyer(sp)
She was once asked when the suicide bombings would stop. She answered "when the Palestenians love their children more than they hate us, it will stop"
She also said one other thing that has stuck with me - "to the terrorists, I can forgive you for killing my sons, but I can not forgive you for making my sons kill your sons"
Interesting thoughts from her perspective.
Posted by RareSS (Member # 1818) on :
Uh, let's see here now.......slaughter a whole lot of pigs and do a fly-over spilling pork blood droplets and small pieces of pork entrails all over them and their "country"? I bet none of them would even come close to wanting to fight then! They would not be protected by their...ha ha "god" and get anywhere close to heaven! Just an amusing thought. Jim
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