I know one of the most common issues with the 4th gen F-Body is the power window motors going out. My SS windows started acting up last night and I wanted to run this by y'all to see if you think the window motors are the culprit.
Basically, neither power window motor works. If I start the car, the power window fuse gets hot. Really, really hot. So hot, in fact, that I burned my finger tips trying to remove it this morning (didn't have a pair of needle-nose pliars handy).
I suspect that one of the motors is shorted out. If I pull the fuse, then re-insert it, the windows will run up and down just fine, but as soon as I let off the window button, they quit working again.
The owners manual says the power windows are protected by a circuit breaker that opens and closes as needed. My suspicion is that one of the motors has a short and that it's overloading, tripping the breaker.
I bought a new 30A fuse from GM today (only $9 w/tax -- what a deal!) and it behaves the same way, so it's nothing with the fuse.
At this point, I'm positive one of my motors is bad (they're both original, and the car is 5 years old now).
Any suggestions?
Posted by SSHEETS (Member # 1989) on :
Sounds like it might be a bad connection at the fuse...maybe.
If you're getting that much heat, but the fuse isn't blowing out, you could have a high resistance connetion which would have big I squared R but also limit the current through the fuse. It would also drop the voltage getting to the window motor.
It's worth checking out...do you know anybody with a good volt/ohm meter and a little electrical know how?
Posted by 2002Z4CSS (Member # 1393) on :
If the power window circuit breaker is getting hot the minute the key is turned on, it is not the motors, rather there is a short between the circuit breaker and the power window switch. If the breaker got hot only after the key was on and the switch was depressed, then the short could be the motor or the wiring from the switch to the motor.
Posted by Bill Mason (Member # 1807) on :
Just thinking out loud here.
As I recall there is an electronic control that senses current draw and shuts the window motor down when the current spikes at full down or full up. If this module has stopped working voltage and current would continue to applied to the motor which over a short period of time could make the fuse rather.....warm!!
Posted by westell (Member # 2034) on :
you would have "open" as opposed to "short"
i would agree with your summation based on your writing.
if you want to do the motors youself, there are excellent directions with photos at www.camaroz28.com
do a search in tech.
the great thing is you can just drill holes to expose rivets, drill them out, and replace the motors without removing glass or regulator. takes about 1.5 hours.
i finally did it myself and didn't go blind Posted by SSHEETS (Member # 1989) on :
quote:Originally posted by westell:
i finally did it myself and didn't go blind
Posted by 99PewterSS (Member # 564) on :
Thank for the tips, everyone. I'm still troubleshooting this. I got started on it last night and then the lightning started (from the sky, not the car), so I had to stop sooner than I would have liked to.
I have the official '99 GM service manual, and what's weird is that the troubleshooting chart for "Power Windows - All Inoperative" says nothing about bad motors being a cause. Per the troubleshooting chart, they're point me toward a short in the ground circuit, which I just can't believe -- the circuit is too simple.
Bill is correct that there is a power window control module, but again, the official GM troubleshooting chart doesn't implicate that as a possible cause.
My next step is to jumper the power window connector to power the motors individually. If I can hook up the motors independently w/o the fuse burning my hand off, then I'll change the switch out. Hopefully it'll be that simple. Otherwise, if the fuse gets hot with one of the motors hooked up, then I'll assume that motor is out.
wetsell, thanks pointing me toward cz28. Hunting for instructions to change the motor was going to be my next search. Posted by 99PewterSS (Member # 564) on :
Here's a brief udpate -- There is definitely some kind of short with the wiring in the door, just as the shop manual said. As I closed the drivers door today, I noticed the radio display went dim, then off, then came back on, and sure enough, the windows were dead. I re-opened the door, shut the car off, turned the key to "acc" and slowly closed the door. At about half way closed, I could hear something arc inside the front part of the door and at the same time the radio display did it's thing again. So there I suspect there is a wire causing a short. Next step is to tear into the door and trace the wiring back to the fuse block and the ground strap.
Posted by Steve da Wrench (Member # 1301) on :
Most likely your problem is inside the rubber boot in the doorjamb where all the wires bend back and forth every time you open/close the door. A very common problem on all kinds of cars. You will most likely have to take apart the door, and pull the harness into the inside of the car, then replace the damaged section of wire. Just make sure you look for other wires that are starting to crack/break as well. DONT you butt connectors. Solder and heat shrink with a sealing type of heat shrink tube. ALso, you want to install the new wire section so the new joints are not in the door opening area, as that will create an instant weak spot, and break the wire again VERY soon. Good luck!
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