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The new one has mucho articles on the demise of the F-body!! It is over and done with! they do not seem to hold out much IF any hope. Looks like any type of RWD performce vehicle will be a vette, Ford or Mopar! GM seems to be into the Z24 and such!! AGGGGHHH!!!
Posts: 918 | From: Davie, Fl., USA | Registered: Feb 2000
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posted
Well DC announced that they will in fact be offering a rwd "performance oriented" car, but don't hold your breath that it will be anything comparable to the current f-body...they consider a Mercedes 3-series sedan "performance oriented". Maybe a nice car, but definitely not my cup of tea.
I think that GM will probably bring back the Camaro sometime in the future on a rwd chassis, but they can go so many directions with that...anywhere from the much publicized retro concept Camaro to a Holden clone...and anything in between. Maybe our best bet would be to buy the hottest '02 available, and after 2 or 3 years if GM doesn't step back up to the plate, the car payments will be pretty much behind us and we can pretty much afford to drop in the LS6 (or LS7, or whatever the performance offering dujour will be by them). GM will no doubt lose a bunch of the f-body faithful to the Vette, Viper, Ford, BMW or maybe even to Porsche, but that's something that would probably happen to some extent in any case. It will just remain to be seen if the GM beancounters will ever again see a GM rwd performance chassis in a favorable (i.e. profitable) light...
...in the meantime, we still drive some of the hottest performance cars on the road today...
Let's enjoy them today, and not worry too much about what might happen tomorrow...
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I have to agree with Jimbo. We drive the fastest most affordable hottest performance cars on the road today. I don't think, like some of the silicon valley types that a Mercedes 3 series is a performance car. That is what DC will bring out for there RWD car. That is fine, I will drive my F-body and blow the doors off of them.
------------------ Tony C 2000 SS # 0100 Red, T-Tops, M6, Floor Mats, Key Fobs, SLP Resonator Exhaust, Whisper lid, STB
Posts: 52 | From: Mtn. View, CA, USA | Registered: Aug 2000
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Sorry Jimbo - I don't agree. Yes, I believe that at some point GM will probably bring back the Camaro name and hopefully it will still retain the status it enjoys today. Hopefully they have enough sense to not turn it into the joke that's become some of the other names they've resurrected in the past.
However, the first rule of business is that you don't give up market share. It's much harder to recapture it once it's gone than it is to keep what you have and build on it. Let's face it, a stripped down version of the Corvette is still going to be out of reach for most Camaros owners, and even with all the hype about their new pickup, most Camaro owners that I know aren't willing to replace their car with a pickup. If we wanted a pickup we would have bought one.
I know we don't know all the particulars concerning GM's situation or the reasons behind the decisions, but to just give up the market to Ford and the others? Sure GM will eventually come out with something, the question is how long will it take? how long will the die hard fans wait? will they wait? You can bet Ford and the others will jump all over this to convert the bow-tie brigade to their brands. What a market coup - come on over to us - we care about you - we'd never drop you like Chevy did..you get the general drift. I know I'm not alone in wondering what the heck Chevy's marketing people are doing. Just my .02
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I also read the GM High Tech - I like that Mag.
Funny - the better the performance i.e. the faster the car, the fewer the sales.
Many people were intimidated by the speed of the LS1 F body. I think the biggest downfall is the seating/windshield - guess where the front is? My wife will drive with me, but claims the windshield gives her a headache, and the bump in the floor is annoying. She did "sit" in a Mustang, and liked that view much better. Nuff said. I'm keeping the SS!
quote:Originally posted by SSBOB: Sorry Jimbo - I don't agree...the first rule of business is that you don't give up market share. It's much harder to recapture it once it's gone than it is to keep what you have and build on it.
...another rule of business is to know who butters your bread and to now how to maximize your profits while limiting your expenditures and liability. GM would give up the F-body market share in a proverbial heartbeat (no pun intended)if they could replace it with twice as many buyers purchasing higher priced SUVs that carry larger profit margins...and that's pretty much what they've been doing, and will continue to do. As much as a lot of people here hate SUVs, that's what people are buying right now, and in all probability will continue to do so at least for the foreseeable future. Let's face it, in a perfect world you could offer a little (or a lot) of everything...and make everyone happy...but GM has limited facilities, a limited production capacity, and limited personnel resources...and they have to keep it this way if they are to remain competitive. Companies give up market shares all the time if it means picking up a greater share in another market...that's just a fact of a competitive business environment. I'm sure that someone in GMs business management office has done a cost trade-off on this and convinced management that this is the way to go. Bottom line, they're in business to make money, and the end justifies the means. As much as people rant and rave about GM not caring about us and having their heads up the @$$e$, they're not stupid...
...they wouldn't have remained in business all these years if they were...
quote:Originally posted by alfredf00_1673: The new one has mucho articles on the demise of the F-body!! It is over and done with! they do not seem to hold out much IF any hope. Looks like any type of RWD performce vehicle will be a vette, Ford or Mopar! GM seems to be into the Z24 and such!! AGGGGHHH!!!
It will surely be a sad day when GM officially pulls the plug at a car which is as American as apple pie. But, like many have said, GM is out to make a profit and the F-Body isn't making the money they'd like to see. I'd like to comment that as much as I love the 4th gen Camaro, it is just too big for the tastes of many. I've always believed that if the current generation Camaro/Firebird was the same physical size as the Mustang it would be selling much better. Folks honestly prefer the smaller size of the Mustang. I saw an artist rendering about a year ago (same magazine I think) of a 5th gen Camaro which was about the size of the '69 Camaro/'01 Mustang with a definite '69 retro look. It was love at first sight! How I wish GM could have seen the potential in this car. Designed properly and outfitted with the LS1 or LS6 engine this could have been BIG. At least that's my opinion.
In the meantime, enjoy your Camaros and Firebirds. They're some of the best muscle cars on the road.
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I agree with a lot of the points above. One thing we cant forget is that the high end performance segment of a platform doesnt pay the bills. The V8 F bods show similar #s to the V8 Mustang, BUT in the V6 segment that is where the Mustang pulls way ahead. As enthusiasts we put up with the dash/cowl, the hump,etc. But the average consumer wouldnt and obviously doesnt. To make the car smaller and tighter I suggest they go to something like the Northstar. It puts out enough power, is a tighter package and has been converted for RWD for the upcoming Caddy Roadster. That would allow less overhang etc. As for retro, nah skip it, its a trend. GMs business is to make money, pay dividends to share holders and build lots of cars that sell. Hopefully they respect the name in the future.
------------------ F99-0447 1 of 30 Arctic White A4 Coupes.
Posts: 277 | From: Peoria, AZ | Registered: Feb 2000
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Good post on SLP Lounge section! Under 'You got to readthis now" excellent article.
Posts: 918 | From: Davie, Fl., USA | Registered: Feb 2000
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Maybe a nice car, but definitely not my cup of tea.
